Podcast 019: How to date older women? A.K.A Cougars

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Menprovement Podcast 

Ready to take your life to the next level? Then you’re in the right place. Get all the information you need to improve everything and live life like a pro. This is the Menprove podcast with Sean Russell.

Sean 

Welcome back to the Menprovement podcast, brought to you by Menprovement.com. The number one self-improvement resource strictly for men had their app on the show to get your free self-improvement starter kit, including your free eBook on how to triple your testosterone naturally. I’m your host, Sean Russell, and today I have an epic show for you. I think it’s safe to say that the fantasy of most single men is to be with a hot Cougar. Whether it be that older woman you work with, one of your friend’s hot moms, or one of your mom’s friends who came over to drop something off, Mommy’s not home, Well, today I have on the show just that: a hot 62-year-old Cougar who’s going to show you how you can make your fantasies come true. Catherine B. Han is an accidental Cougar who now teaches men the art of seduction, specifically when it comes to older women. And in this episode, she kills it, and you’re going to love it. Before we jump into it. I just want to say thank you for all the support and look forward to an even better podcast in the new year. I’m going to step up this podcast a notch and hit the best guests around with the best topics to help you be the best. I’ve got some great interviews coming up, including one with Sasha Cobra, one of the most prolific sexual and spiritual teachers. And she’s going to teach you how to be the guy that all the women talk about when other guys aren’t around because you’ll be the best sex in town. We’ve also got stuff on travel, finance, and much more coming. And if you want a topic covered, tweet us at Menprovement or email me at Sean at menfroma.com. I’ll make it happen. And if we want to make sure you hear all this great stuff, download the podcast app on your phone and search Menprovement. Subscribe to iTunes. And you’ll get free updates every week and when every new episode comes out. And after you’re done with that, check out our sponsor, ownonly.com, and grab yourself a custom suit fit for your body for only $300. Most custom suits cost around $800. And that’s after a trip to the tailor, and tailoring your suit from Macy’s is an additional $100 to $200 on top of what you’ve spent. But if you go to only.com, you can get a custom suit sent to your doorstep without ever leaving the house for only $300. It’s crazy, it’s easy, and the quality is quality. Check them out only.comThat’s ownonly.com, and use the coupon code MPSUIT to get $30 off your order above $200. But without further ado, I know you’re excited. So let’s jump into today’s show. How to meet a cougar and make her yours  Catherine will be here. Hey guys, I’m here with Catherine V. Han. She’s an author, coach, and owner of Cougar Club Academy, and I just connected with her because she wanted to start writing for men’s permit.com. She’s a self-proclaimed accidental Cougar who now coaches young men in the art of seduction. How are you, Catherine? Thanks so much for coming on the show.

How did you become an accidental cougar?

Catherine B. Han

I’m great. Sean, it’s nice to meet you too. And I can tell by your voice that you are indeed younger. May I ask how old you are?

Sean 

Yeah, I’m 25, a cup…

Catherine B. Han

Well, it’s nice to meet you. I am every bit as old as 62. And I did send you a picture too, which you probably don’t think is the real me.

Sean 

No, I did. You’re a very attractive 62-year-old, I must say.

Catherine B. Han

Thanks a lot. I’m just so passionate about being able to connect consenting adults. You know, I’m not here about anything other than connecting consenting adults. And if it’s okay with you, I just like to tell a little story and kind of set the stage for how I got here.

Sean 

Yeah, I was going to ask you that because I’d love to know how you became, you know, an accidental Cougar per se.

Catherine B. Han

Well, once upon a time, because, you know, women are in love with fantasy. But this is a true story. Once upon a time, there was a little girl who grew up in a large Catholic family. She was the oldest and had seven younger brothers. So she was always very comfortable with men and understood a lot about their competitive nature and sometimes confusing behavior. She grew up intending to get married and have a family because that’s what everyone did. And she did that. Unfortunately, though, by the time her marriage got to the point where the children went to college, there was nothing left between the husband and wife. And so she moved on. And she moved across the country, started a brand new life somewhere, and met a second man. And this man swept into her life and seemed like a grand provider and a lover, was affectionate and kind, and was everything that she was missing from her first relationship. But lo and behold, after a couple of years, that also passed and faded. And it turned out that that man was not who she hoped he would be. And so, a second divorce followed. And as you can start to tell, this little girl is grown up. But at the end of the day, once I had gotten away from that second man and was starting life on my own, I decided that I did not want to be in a relationship and didn’t even think about dating. And lo and behold, a young man came across my path, quite a bit younger than me. And he started to flirt with me, and I was kind of blind to it. I didn’t believe it. He was way too young. And yet, he was fascinating to me. And we’re going to get to talk more about this, Shawn because he was very smart. And he and I are still involved; we have a physical-only friend-with-benefits relationship that is working for both of us. And I want to tell you, 50 years ago, when I was a teenager—I know it’s a long time ago—I never thought that was possible. The idea that I can tell you that the words sex and fun, were never used in the same sentence at Any time in my life, until now, at my age, when I am having fun with sex And with this young man, who is only 17 years younger than me, that makes him 45. I

Sean 

I thought you were going to say you were 17 versus, Oh,

Catherine B. Han

He’s, and I do attract a lot of Cougars or cubs, sorry, in their 20s and 30s. But the 40s are my favorite decade. I can talk about that later, too, and how a cub could pick a suitable Cougar. But what I wanted to explore was the idea of sex for pleasure. And yes, sex in a relationship with a forever-after person If you didn’t know, that’s awesome. But what I’ve discovered is that there’s a whole world of sexual pleasure outside of committed relationships. And that’s a bit controversial, but it is working for me. So that’s how I got here.

Sean 

Yeah, it’s a really interesting story. And I can see how you never kind of mixed up the whole sexual pleasure part growing up Catholic; when was it when you had your final divorce?

Catherine B. Han

I’ve been single for the second time; my divorce was finalized in April. But I’ve been single since August. So it’s been just over a year and a half since I’ve been single. And you know, what I found was that once my friend’s benefits came into the picture, And Shawn, it’s so fun. It reminds me of some of your other interviews, which I’ve listened to. And I know you can be frank about these programs, which I appreciate. But it reminds me of having a guy friend that I would maybe go rock climbing with or whitewater rafting with—you know, some kind of physical exercise, a fun experience. And we have great, fantastic sex, and it’s like, Let’s go have a beer. And there’s no relationship. There’s no texting, and there’s no calling. And there are rules, quote, unquote, and I do write about this. There’s a difference between a boyfriend (or girlfriend) and a sex buddy. And women must know that and know how to manage it. But it is very, very doable because I love being single. And I love that he lives in his house. I don’t carry a burden for his life responsibilities, his career, or his finances; there are no in-laws, you know; we are just really enjoying a lot of, well, not a lot. That’s the problem. Here’s where we learned what happened. One of the things about a sex buddy is that you must not have sex very often. The farther apart the sex is, the better it is, which is kind of crazy. But it does make sense if you think about it because absence does make the heart grow fonder. But when I married my last husband, I was married for eight years, and for most of that time, he was older than me, and he didn’t have much of a sexual appetite. So, I was dormant. I didn’t understand; I didn’t know what was possible. I’m not kidding. And so I want to say that one of the first things is that if your young men are listening and they’re interested in dating an older woman, chances are that she’s been underserved. Or not aware of what an orgasm is really like. And many times, clubs will think, Oh, gosh, you know, she’s an experienced woman. She knows about sex. True, but in my case, I had shut myself down and went into dormancy because of an unpleasant relationship. So, when this young man helped me find that—and I want to tell you, Sean, the best sex happened in the backseat of my car, making out with our clothes on— I mean, he knew how to go slow. And he knew how to disarm me. So, once I began to have the sexual energy come back up through me, that was it, I wish I could describe it accurately for you. Because I had been turned off for many years, when that came alive in me, I felt like it was a fountain of youth. I mean, I felt like I was 17. And I get goosebumps right now telling you about it. It was 17 only better because I evolved, my father is not going to come around and shoot the guy and I evolved, I can’t get pregnant, you know, so having the sexual freedom and enjoying making out like a part of me when I was 17 And so, I began to believe that he liked my body and that he wanted to please me. And for the other men in my life, that had not been true. It was all about them. And even for my ex to lose his sexual desire and not have any interest in whether I still wanted to be sexual, You know, I don’t blame him. Because I chose him. Nobody tied me up and threw me at the altar. But the reality is, at my age right now, I am so much more open about sex and talking about it than I ever have before.

How to go about meeting an older woman?

Sean 

Yeah, absolutely. And there are so many incredible points that are running through my head that I would love to pick your brain about. So I’m going to start asking you some questions, please. There are a couple of things I want to talk about, and I’ll just go over them all real quick. And then we’ll jump into one of them at a time. The first is, you know, a lot of guys’ fantasy. I feel like to be with an older woman like you’re describing, and I’m sure a lot of people listening are like, wow, you know, this would be incredible. So, I want to talk about how to go about it as a younger guy, say 25. How to go about meeting an older woman And then I want to talk about how, as you mentioned, you had this perfect sex with, you know, just friends-with-benefits relationships, which I’ve been in before, but every time I’ve found that after a while, it starts to get to the point where the girl is kind of asking me, What’s going on? Are we going to be something that never ends? Well, for me at least. So I want to go over tips you have for guys to maintain a purely Friends with Benefits relationship, because that’s, you know, what a lot of guys want right now. For me as an entrepreneur, it would be almost impossible for me to have a relationship. And I know a lot of people are in the same position. So let’s just start with the first one. I mean, I’ve been approaching girls now for three to six months, off and on. And during my time, I’ve only actually approached two older women, both with pretty successful, like amazing interactions. And, I love approaching what I call Mills because I find they react so incredibly, and one took my number, but nothing ever came with it. So, for a 25-year-old guy like me, I guess you’d call me a cub? What? Like, how would I go about finding an older woman, as an older divorcee says, to have an incredible sexual relationship like this?

Catherine B. Han

Well, I hear you, and I love what you said. And actually, I do kind of call the 20-something couplets And I got that term from a couplet that wrote to me, and a lot of 20-somethings contact me. And for me, Sean’s 20s are young. There is a woman out there named Cynthia Gallup; she has a website called Make Love Not Porn. And I would recommend that your listeners take a look at her. She’s outstanding. And she has created a website where people can submit their videos of real love and real sex. So, it’s not porn. And her point is that if we were less encumbered by all of the, you know, porn out there and looked at real people making love, which is voyeuristically quite exciting, that it’s real, it’s real love, so I’ll just pass that along, or maybe you could interview her, that would be awesome. But anyway, what happened to me is that after I started my relationship with my young man, he wasn’t available very often. And I started researching friends with benefits. And there are definite things you need to do, and one of them is that you have to help your woman by being very organized in your approach. It is not a love relationship. So, there aren’t, you know, hangouts; you don’t cuddle. Interestingly enough, I mean, you have sex, and it’s very real, and certainly, I would love to write a piece for your website on this so I can detail it. But one of the big things is to realize that this is just a physical exercise between you and a woman. Part of it is in your intention when you’re going to go to a website. Now, I do belong to a couple of Cougar Cub dating websites. So I recommend that you go, and Sean, I’m telling you, if you follow my tips, you’re going to get a lot of attention. And I’ll tell you why. Because the men that are trying to approach me online are making a huge mistake. And I imagine maybe even some of your listeners have one thing in common. I’ll interrupt myself by saying that there’s a difference between a MILF, a GILF, and a cougar. I qualify as a GILF. Right now, I’m a grandmother. And thank you for looking at my picture. No, no way. But I have a very young spirit. And luckily, I have a petite body, and I know how to use it at this point. But what happens is that I put my profile out there, and I do put an honest picture of what my face looks like on the site. And then I just say what I want in there, which is that I’m not into a one-night hookup. That’s not true; I don’t have sex with strangers. Forever. It’s not in my mouth; some do. But I think when the milk and guilt stuff is kind of in the past, the New Age look is the cougar, and I think there’s a classy Cougar. And I think a cougar who wants to have sex once has no problem with that. But as a cub approaching these women, what’s happening is that when these guys write me their approach in an email, because it’s all email first, they lead sexually. I mean, they are gross. And if I could be very upfront with you and give you a direct quote, this is a fairly handsome guy. Probably. I think he was 31. And what he wrote to me in my email box was, My cock is hard and dripping with pre-come for you, baby. Now, I don’t know about you. Maybe men would like that if a woman wrote something like here, they are on the very first comment. But what I would say is, would you go out on a first date? Sit down at the table. Buy that girl a cup of coffee, whip it out, and lay it on the table.

Sean 

Probably not me.

Catherine B. Han

Right? And so 99% And I’m not lying. I delete 99% of cubs trying to approach me. There is no one else out there. Well, last night, I took that bet. Last night, a 37-year-old guy was so sweet on the phone. He was texting very politely. I think you’re beautiful. He said I wrote back. Thank you. So would you ever date someone younger? And I said yes, certainly. And he said I’d like the honor of seeing you. Guess what? We’re going to go out Friday night. We’re having a date. I told him that I’m not in a one-night-stand mindset. That’s not what I’m looking for. He said that he isn’t either.

The three types of cougars

This leads me to the three types of cougars out there. May I tell you what the three types are?

Sean

I’d love to hear yes.

The Rookie cougar

Catherine B. Han

Okay. There’s Coker number one, the rookie Cougar. As a rookie Cougar, Shawn, you have to be aware that there are Cougars like me right now who are very experienced. I understand what it’s like to be aroused. I understand what it’s like to control my orgasm and know where it goes and how to include a man in it. So I’m there. But I wasn’t there a year ago. I was a rookie cook, and the rookies are scared. Excited. You know, the idea that a young man like your age would be interested in me So flattering. I mean, it’s a little hard for me to believe the 20-somethings claim that they are. However, I don’t close the door because anything’s possible. But generally speaking, a rookie cougar is going to be anxious. Chances are, she’s been hurt by men. Chances are, she’s had some sexual bullies in her life. And so she’s extremely careful. If she’s divorced, the guy might have been a real jerk. And so she’s suspicious of every man. So that’s one thing to find out when you’re doing your communications: how long she’s been dating someone younger. If it’s brand new, it will help you. There’s a super secret here that always works. Shawn, may I tell you? Yes, please. Pretend it’s her first time. If you put in your mind that your woman is a virgin, even if she’s 40, and you don’t treat her disrespectfully about that, you just approach her like she was experiencing sex for the first time. You will endear yourself to her. We love to be cared for. And so when the cup is full, that’s why the agenda is so important, especially when you’re approaching your cougars. If your agenda is I want to learn how to please a woman, I want to have a woman experience an orgasm because of what I do. And that’s 100% of your motivation. Great. If your motivation is to get late, get off, and have your own sexual experience, regardless of whether she comes or not, that’s okay, too. There’s something for everyone. For me personally and the Cougars that I know, when a man is 100% focused on his pleasure, there is nothing like it. I overheard you talking to JD Dallas about the modern way to see the modern male lifestyle, just because he talks so much about the alpha male. And I have to tell you that even on the phone, you can hear a man’s voice if he’s turned on by you, and that’s so attractive.

And I love that. But I think sometimes the Alpha kind of gets confused, and they start coming out like these aggressive sexual bullies that are not alpha, right? No, no, no. And maybe they’re afraid of being beta. And they’re trying to pretend they’re alpha, but they’ve got to go talk to JD, and then it could come over. But, um, anyway, for the rookies, you’ve got to be careful. You just take your time. With this young man that I’m with, Shawn, it took five months before we were sexual. Wow. No kidding. And so I didn’t see him very often. He would show up at work for projects. You know, he was nice to me. At first, I did not know he was flirting with me because I wasn’t looking. And then, slowly but surely, it came to a head, so to speak, on Valentine’s Day, when I happened to be alone in the office. And he stepped in, and we had met in September, I think somewhere around there. And he said, Do you like chocolate? And I said,  he said, I’ll be right back. He went out and bought me Reese’s Peanut Butter Bits in a little orange. And he brought it back to me. And when he came in, I wasn’t looking at my back. I was doing some stalking. And he came up to me, kissed the back of my neck, and handed me that chocolate. And everything changed. My heart dropped. and I began to accept his approaches. But think about the patient now that he’s 45 years old. Maybe when he was 25, he would not have had that restraint. And also, he knew I was newly separated. And oh, he did the cutest thing one day. He said, How old are you anyway? And he said 52 I said you are not. And he goes. I was trying to think of an age that you would accept. Yeah, so I said no. How old are you? Are you? Really? He said 45. And it was still another three weeks after that kiss on the back of my neck before we got together.

Sean 

Wow. I mean, it’s, uh, this is great stuff, you know, because I think the way Cougars are portrayed in movies and on TV You know, you would never think that to go slow because everyone portrays cougars; you know, there are TV shows about cougars. You know, you watch American Pie with Stiffler’s mom, and you have things like this. And I don’t think it’s based on what you’re saying. It’s not reality. But in reality, what you’re saying is that the fastest way to a cougar’s heart is through Reese’s Pieces. No, I’m kidding. But through respect and being sincere, this is like advice that people probably wouldn’t give to a girl who’s 25. I’ve talked to a lot of people about meeting younger women, but it sounds like it’s just a completely different world when you’re dealing with older women, with respect, sincerity, and kind of being very charming. Yes, that’s the way to go about it.

Catherine B. Han

Well, not only that, but they say studies have shown that women over 50 value fondling, cuddling, and touching more than intercourse. They just do, and that’s the thing. There’s so much missing with that foreplay, in the magic, in the fascination with really letting that happen. I’m interrupting my list of three kinds of cougars, but I just want to make this point about the time between, and you know what, Shawn, the cool thing is, you can use these techniques with younger women because it’s a matter of connection. After all, you want her to connect with you. You want it, even if it’s for a moment of hi, hi hot sex.

Sex-only cougars and hookers

Or if it’s for last, it’s like If a girl feels like you care about her and for her, she wants to lean in and spend more time with you. And there isn’t enough touch, and we’re all touched-deprived in our culture. You know, people are afraid to hug now because they’ll get a germ. I’m nervous about that. But let me talk now because we have our rookies, who are first-timers. And that’s one issue. The second kind of cougar is a sex-only Cougar. And just like you mentioned, some women love to hook up. They write to me, and some of them disagree with me because of my stance on the classy Cougar, which is just a different stance. And the women who enjoy sex are prepared. You know, Tinder is an app that people are using to hook up, actually in Australia, where there are sex workers legally in parts of Australia. And they’re saying that the sex business is going down because of apps like Tinder and other apps where people are hooking up without paying for it. Sometimes I’ll say to guys, Listen, if you want to hook or buy a hooker, you know if you want a woman to drop to her knees and worship at the throne of your cock, fantastic. Find one if you want to find one that’ll jump in the sack and have great sex with you in a second. They’re out there. And maybe you’re lucky and you’ll find some that you don’t have to pay for. But these are different kinds of sexual appetites. Now for me, after I have my sex, Buddy comes into my life. And we meet occasionally, maybe once a month or so. Sometimes longer than that. And so in between times, I’m like, Okay, well now, what do I do? I don’t want I’m not promiscuous. I love sex. I love orgasms. I’m not promiscuous, though. I’m not one of the types who want sex from anybody because of safety reasons and other reasons. So I went to Google, and I Googled erotic chat because I was curious about what was out there. Of course, millions of hits popped up. And I started to explore the erotic chat network to see about connecting in cyberspace, because, as I like to say, cyberspace is safer. You know, there’s no physical contact. And believe me, women look at 50 Shades of Grey, for Pete’s sake, and think that he is going to knock it out of the park when it comes out, as the books did. Because women crave erotica. And erotica is different from porn. Erotica is like porn, more or less. Yeah, I jumped in. And I started trying to find some erotica and partners that would have fun with me. But I ran into the same problem, you know, amended, which is right? I mean, Shawn, it’s embarrassing. God, I love you guys. Bless you. I know you’re trying to appeal to us; you’re trying to get us to want sex with you. But the stuff that men write me is awful. Delete, delete, delete, delete. And so the thing that I would say, even if you’ve got a woman who just wants sex, is that there’s one thing you must avoid. And that is you. You don’t want to ever have a woman react to you? Because she’ll delete you in one second.

Sean 

Yeah. I just want to say that it sounds like, from a male perspective, you would think that, oh, you know, maybe this might work. But I think purely because 99% of guys are approaching this way online with very sexual messages, just not doing that and doing it, like you said, like saying, You know, you’re very beautiful, blah, blah, blah, is kind of just separating yourself from the pack. And it’s what works?

Catherine B. Han

Yep. Yep. Tell me about it. I mean, it works for me. You know, I’m in high demand; hundreds of men contact me. I don’t date married men; I get a lot of married men. And that’s part of why I started to write erotica—because men want to write erotica. So I have a website called Angel Says Yes.com. And Angel is my alter ego. And you know, I edit, write, and publish. This kind of PG-rated erotica is like, You don’t have to say the names, the gross names, the vernacular. And unless you like your results now, either the 99 guys or 99% of the guys, I delete, delete, delete, and now and then one will catch my attention. And I’ll write to him and say, God, I love you. Bless your heart, does this work? How much action are you getting? And they always go, well, not so well. And then, you know, that’s why I started teaching this stuff because I am a serial monogamist. I don’t sleep with tons of men all at the same time. But when I write, it’s very erotic for me to write. It’s orgasmic for me to write. And that way, I want to help men because, honestly, if you knew how to write great erotica for your woman, it’d be super fun. I mean, it made me win. One woman who doesn’t love her cell phone is texting all the time. And you wrote a couple of great articles on your site about texting. And I appreciate you putting that out there. Because honestly, if you knew how to say certain things, you would have your woman watching her phone, waiting for you to text back. Instead of cringing. Oh, no, not him. Again, even if it is a sexual-only liaison charm, you’ll be surprised because there are so few cubs that are charming out there. But let me get to my third type of Cougar.

Long-term cougar

The third type of cougar is more like the kind I am because I am a little bit more experienced. And I’m not a rookie anymore. But I’m looking for what I call a relatively long-term relationship, which means that I want, let’s say, a dog barking. That means that I want to get to know you. And I want them to get to know me. You know, read that profile. What does she like? If she’s a golfer, then ask her, Where’s the coolest place you’ve ever golfed?” If she likes wine? Ask her. Do you like red or white? You know, I mean, it’s like being able to get to know her as a woman and as the person that is inside that body that you want to ravish. And so those kinds of cougars—that’s where I think the real value comes for both the cub and the cougar. Because I have a lot to learn from a young man. I like seeing myself reflected in his eyes. I feel better about myself. The healing, honestly, the sexual healing I’ve had from this young man who really appreciates my body but also treats me with kindness and humor We have fun together. One of the first things that happened, Shawn, was one of our first love stories. I’m getting so personal here; I hope you don’t mind. But one of the first times we were together, it was so wonderful. And I said I love you. And I went Wait, no, no, I didn’t mean to say that. I’m sorry. I don’t love you. No, no, no, no, no. And he was so cute. He goes, Shut up. I said, No, seriously, I just want you to know that I’m not going to fall for you. And I made this whole speech because I know what I want, which is physical. And he was so great about it. He just hugged me and said, Don’t worry about it. Now, when I have sex with him, I’ll say, I love having sex with you. And it is a loving time, even though it’s temporary. Because when you’re honoring someone’s body and bringing that much pleasure to them, It is a very sacred time, whether you’re going to commit or not. And I have to tell you that once a woman is filled up, satisfied, and feeling delicious, pleasing her man is fabulous. And so the men say, Well, what about me? And why should I do all that for you? What about me, you know what? Delete, delete, delete, because those men can go find their women. And maybe those are the assholes. Alpha guys, I don’t know. But I attract the kind of men who see me as valued not only for my body but for my mind and how I’ve gotten through life to be 62. You know, being able to take care of myself and enjoy my life I would love to chat with a man your age and let you know what I needed back when I was in my 20s, 30s, and 40s. So that you could be the kind of husband who makes it work. So the relatively long term of it is very appropriate for certain people at certain times because they can come together, have a friendship relationship, enjoy one another, and then go on. Because not many 30-year-olds want to marry a 62-year-old? And that’s fine; some do. But it’s almost guaranteed to be a short-term relationship while both move on to something more appropriate.

Sean 

Yeah. So when I asked you first, What’s the best way for a guy like me to meet a cougar? Did you go? You went straight to the online websites. So would you say that it’s better to approach older women online than, you know, seeing a beautiful 50- to 60-year-old woman in the mall and approaching her there and seeing if she’s divorced or whatnot?

Catherine B. Han

I think that the online stuff is great for practice, and it’s excellent for communicating back and forth and practicing your texting skills. You could likely meet one, but I would love for men to approach me more out there in the world. And so I would say to you, I love when you Kiss, kiss, yawn, and she said that wonderful thing. I know this is Random. But I love that. I love that because, honestly, Shawn, you could come to my door if I’m looking at your picture, or you could come up to me at Starbucks. And you could say, I know this is random, but I would say that would work for me. So I would say to do a ring check. Look at that left hand. If there’s no ring on there, you know, I go right on up and say the worst thing that can happen is they could say, No, I’m dating someone or I’m not interested. But I find it so flattering when younger men are interested in me. Now when they say it at first, I don’t believe it. You know, because I think they think I’m that second kind of cougar and they just want to have quick sex, let’s go to a hotel room. So I might dodge a little bit. But that’s what I’m saying. If you are savvy and you come on with true interest in her as a woman, not just a sex object, I would love to be approached more out there. I have to say my goal for 2015 What I’m planning to do personally is approach more men because I don’t have good luck on dating sites. And I’m thinking when I do see a man that’s attractive to me, by in-contact, right? I want to have the courage to go up to him, whatever his age is, and say, and I know this is random, but I couldn’t help but notice that you’re attractive, whatever I want to say, and ask him if he would want to have coffee with me because we are surrounded by people every day, and who knows, one of them might be a partner. I like the online stuff for practice. It’s a great practice for connecting. But as you know, I support going out and approaching older women. And again, as long as your motivation is clear and not every man wants to please women, Shawn, I understand that. Not every man finds it exciting to bring sexual pleasure to the woman he’s with. That’s okay. It’s just that for certain women, the sooner they know that’s true, the more clarity you’ll have on whether that’s the right woman for you.

How to approach an attractive woman

Sean  

Yeah, absolutely. And I can say from experience, as I told you, that I’ve only ever approached two older women that were both, I mean, I would say probably 45 years old, and they were both beautiful. It was the best response that I’ve had from any girl. Because usually if you sincerely approach anyone and tell them, Hey, this is random, I know, But I just saw you, and I had to tell you how incredible you look. You’re going to get a good response no matter what unless you are just very new and very nervous, and they can tell. But once you get past the nerves, you’re going to get a good response from the woman, even if she’s married. he was thrilled. I could tell that I made her day when she hugged me. And she was like If I wasn’t married, I would, you know, yeah. Yeah. And then the next woman wasn’t married; she was divorced. And it was a great 15-minute conversation. You know, we were holding hands. She took my number, but she never used it. I mean, maybe she chickened out; who knows, but it’s it, and I can tell that you guys are very receptive to that genuine, sincere approach. So don’t be afraid to go out and try it.

Catherine B. Han

Yep, I would say so. Because I do think that once it’s a little bit easier, women will resist the younger guy at first because it’s still taboo. I mean, I was just researching this morning. And even though we’re here, we’re in 2014. You know, society still looks down on sexually liberated women. And they look down on women dating younger guys. And so you’ve got to remember that you’re a cougar; your woman is living in that pond, you know, with all that disapproval. But once they realize that for a young guy your age, the wisdom and sense of presence that you have are sincere and that you’re not out just for a quick roll in the hay, then they do. I don’t like to overuse the word healing. But it’s good for the ego of a woman who’s been through some tough things to just be adored by somebody. Yeah, and even if it’s just short-term, and I think that’s part of being a young guy, maybe that’s something you guys can think about expressing to your woman at some point. That you realize this is short-term. You know, you realize this is probably not going to last forever. Yeah.

Sean 

Yeah, but you go, you bet.

Catherine B. Han,

you’re utterly fascinated by her.

Sean 

That’s what I wanted to ask you. So, I mean, approaching very sexually is not the best way to go. So when you approach sincerely and genuinely, and as we’ve been talking about, how and when do you make you It is clear that you don’t want a serious relationship because she probably doesn’t want a serious relationship, and you are looking for, you know, a once in a while get to know each other beautiful sexual relationship. And how do you do that?

Catherine B. Han

Well, I find that the guys have been pretty responsive, like in the online community. When I do say when they come on, and I say I’m not interested in one night’s encounters, they go, Okay, see, you know, good luck and have fun. So I think direct is very, very good. For me, it has worked. So, if you’re enamored with a woman, there are some things I can say. So if you guys want to grab a pencil, let me give you five tips on how to maneuver it. And you figure, like, think about parallel parking, for example. You have to maneuver that car into the spot. Are you manipulating it on the spot? Maybe, but you do have to be smart. When you’re dealing with a woman, particularly one that’s quite a bit older. Oh, one tip, Shawn, I will give you if you’re a new cub: if you have never tried dating an older woman, I definitely would try to stick with someone like 10 years older than you. Okay, you know, because I find that when you’re 30 years older than you, you’re biting off more than you can chew, so to speak. And so I would say that a woman 10 years older than you are, maybe 15 years older, is going to be more attractive; there’s less resistance. Now, if you’re 25 and you want to date a 62-year-old, if your darling self came up to me and said something nice, I probably would have coffee with you, and then we would have to see from there. But that’s just a good tip. Try to pick someone 110 to 15 years older at first. But the first thing is seduction. Seduction is very important. And in your intro, you mentioned that I want to teach the art of seduction.

How to seduce a woman

I felt so bad for the 99% of clubs that I delete every day. I just started writing about it. And that’s what the Cougar Cub Academy is, which is on my Facebook page. But I just share resources, including your stuff there, to continue to feed the cubs the things that they need. Seduction is not, you know, pulling on the sheets. Hop in. Seduction is like a mystery. What is it in her that you can tap into? To make her want more? That’s what seduction is. And it comes from reading her profile. Read something in detail, pick out a detail, and choose to get to know why that woman is connected to that. Whether I read one this morning She likes galleries and bookstores. There you go. Where do you like to go? What’s your favorite author? Seduction is not about sex. Seduction is about connection. So that’s having the mindset and intention that you want to be able to seduce in that way. Now are there any, do you see? Are there people out there that seduce you and take you to bed, and that’s all they want? Is that one night? Yes. But true seduction is deeper than that. And makes you want to lean in. And I do teach some stuff on how to text, similar to what you do. And that’s why seduction with text is magical. The second tip is to know subtlety. You have to be subtle. It’s, um, if you feel if there’s any intuitive feeling, oh, this might be a little too much. It is. It is. So when you’re communicating, especially with text and email, read through it yourself and ask yourself, Is there a chance she could be offended? And if there is, back off? I mean, it’s one thing to say your boobs are beautiful. And it’s another thing to say. I can’t believe how great you look for someone your age. How old are you? Yeah. Is that? Yeah, is that picture of you real? You know, so ask questions, but be subtle; you know, take away; and also, it’s just the idea of being PG-rated. Like, write an email or a text tour and then think, Is this PG? and then make it PG because we love that stuff. We love innuendo and sexual banter that’s not sexual. Which brings us to the next tip: sensual, not sexual. Sensuality is different. Sensual is the warm bubble bath, and I mean, I can’t tell you, Sean, the guys, you know what, if you right Talk to me and say, You know, you even have these text exchanges, by the way, because I do have cybersex with certain people and I enjoy it because I’m alone. And it’s a cyber partner, and with erotica and some good sex toys, some cool things can happen at home. And there are some. I do have a sample; you can go to cybersexsample.com. And it’ll give you an exchange that happened to me. And the smart men, they say to me, they text. Can I pour you a glass of wine? Would you like me to rub your shoulders? Those are the men I’m like, yeah. It’s like a thirsty desert, you know when the rest of them are throwing their private parts on the table for me to enjoy. I don’t want any of that. And I’ll tell them to get that out of my face. So it’s sensual. You know, if I were there right now, I’d be running my index finger along your hairline. Yeah, if I were there right now, I would put my finger under your chin and lift it, lift your face, and kiss you. I mean, hello. This is just, you know, not even sexy. Oh, yeah.

Take responsibility for your own sexual pleasure

Sean 

But it’s working on me right now.

Catherine B. Han

And the next one is, number four, satisfaction. Satisfaction. Ladies first, I mean, if you do two things on this, Number one, I think all of us need to take responsibility for our orgasm for our sexual pleasure. When I am in a sexual encounter, my orgasm, my level of pleasure, is up to me. How much I allow or how much my body can release It’s not the man who’s doing it to me. And vice versa. If you and I are having a sexual occasion, it’s your responsibility to take care of yourself sexually. If something I’m not doing is turning you off, Certainly, I want to know it. But the whole idea of solo sex and being able to care for yourself is very refreshing to a cougar. Because it’s not my responsibility. If you get off, it’s not because you have two good hands and some good erotica and some nice cyber chat; take care of it. Because when you’re taking care of yourself and I am taking care of myself, we can be great sexual partners without improperly needing the other person, which was a huge aha for me later in life. So not every cup is going to be good for me because some cubs are very self-focused. And it’s about their orgasm, and they want me to do that. Whereas I will warm up to a man who knows how to put a Lady first. And so that’s a really big success tip. And anyone, if that fails, can write to me and let me know. And the next thing is slow and steady. Remember that my sex buddy took time with me? And it was just how life unfolded. But we women, we do kind of get the idea that we have a three-date window with you guys before we have to have sex; it’s like if we go out, we will give you three, you know, we’ll go out three times and see if there’s a spark. And generally speaking, that kind of thing works. If there is no spark, a lot of guys ghost or disappear. And that’s a whole different talk; we can talk about ghosting, where guys will go out with you three times and disappear if you don’t want to have sex with them. So that’s another thing for you guys to know: if you’re fascinated by this woman, don’t give up. Don’t give up. She may be one of those rookie cooks. She’s been burned by love, and she’s afraid to trust. But if you have some chemistry there and she fascinates you, hang in there because it could very well be worth it. And the conversation you have about life. One of the things is a great tip if you go out on a date, but it’s not working out very well. You met her. And one other point too: I always recommend that you meet your woman. If it’s online, meet her as soon as possible. Meet before you get her phone number. Because if there’s no chemistry, you want to know it immediately. It’s too easy to have fake chemistry online. So you know, sometimes I’ll go to a meeting with a guy with whom there’s no connection. One guy I met looked just like my ex, and I thought I couldn’t date him. I’m sorry. But you look like my ex. So then I asked him How’s online dating been for you? I asked dating questions. It’s a great way to pass what could have been, you know, a bad cup of coffee. Would you say Have you met any great guys? Then, when two people are talking about the successes and failures of being single and dating, you get a lot of laughs. Yeah, that’s

Sean 

a great tip. And I love those five steps, especially the sexual part. I’m interviewing Sasha Cobra in January. I don’t know if you know who she is. But she’s an amazing sexual teacher and sexual healer. So hopefully she’ll be able to guide listeners on the path to, you know, really becoming one with their sexuality and pleasing a woman because what she does is just incredible.

Take responsibility for your own sexual pleasure

So, you know, if you’re interested in that, make sure you keep checking out our podcasts and subscribe. But what I wanted to ask you was, This is all incredible stuff. And if I can recap myself, I think using the internet or meeting her in person and being genuine and sincere, seducing her with your, you know, caring about her and showing genuine interest and, you know, things like that, and being very subtle about your intentions, and then taking her out When do you think it’s an appropriate time? Or would it just happen naturally for things to escalate sexually on a date? One, two, or three?

Catherine B. Han

Okay, I think that’s great. That’s excellent. I went out with a 31-year-old person recently, and we had our three-date thing. And one of the mistakes he made was that he kept telling me how good he was sexually. And I and God love him; you know, he’s like, I’m really good. And that turned me off. It was not, and it was not the way to go. And I think that’s where one of the things that your listeners can do is tune into JD Dallas and his stuff because the whole alpha male thing is awesome. And there’s no sense in reinventing the wheel. Because he says it right. But I think that if you do stuff like touching her arm, you know, there are ways that you can announce your interest in her. That is extremely subtle. You don’t want to talk about how much you want to layer or that you want to be blown away. You know, you don’t want that; it’s just like, No, yeah, get it off the table. It’s like, you could say things like, You need to look at what it looks like; you need to be cuddled. And when he said that to me, I went, You’re right, you know. And so the idea of just being connected and comforting and keeping eye contact Keep asking her about herself; talk to her; let her talk to you.

Sean 

Yeah, and if you do it right, then eventually, you know, she’s going to invite you back to her place for a drink or a call, right? And it’s going to happen naturally. You don’t have to force it.

Catherine B. Han

And she’ll reach out and touch you. That’s the thing like she will reach out and touch you; she will do those things, like play with her hair. You know, she’ll tilt her head and lick her lips. You know, some things sound like Sasha is going to be awesome at sharing some of them. How to watch I can’t wait to talk to her. Yeah, from when a woman gets turned on. But the thing is, if you need me to, you know what? I’m going to write an article about that for the site because I think what you’re asking is a really good sign. Because you don’t want to move too quickly. And you want to watch for her responses. But I think eye contact is just so key. Because the heart is right behind the eyes. And she’ll feel your desire and your connection. If she’s just like a rookie Cougar, she just won’t trust it. See, because it’s like, how could you like me? You know, I went through a lot of that until this guy’s behavior convinced me. He was just cute and funny. I mean, even to go out and buy me, he didn’t buy me a pretty box of candy with a ribbon on it. He just bought me a candy bar. It was endearing.

Sean 

Yeah, this is incredible stuff. I mean, I think we’ve covered pretty much everything, and to bring it full circle and put the icing on the cake, What are the best websites that aren’t filled with a bunch of bots and fake stuff? And maybe they’re free? Maybe they’re not. What’s your opinion?

Catherine B. Han

Well, I do think that’s a really good comment about the bots and stuff, and I hate that. Yeah, I know. I mean, I do. This morning I was on seekingcougars.com. And that’s connected to a larger site that’s been around for about 10 years. One of the things I like to do is check the bottom of the site, like when you’re looking at a cougar site, and see how old the website is. Because if they’ve only been around since 2011, You probably want to move on to someone else. And also, yeah, I’ve had success. I’d like the guys that I’ve met on seeking cougars. Cougarlife.com is another one, but those that when I use, honestly most of the time it’s all delete, delete, delete, delete, you know, and mostly I wish in a way that I don’t want to come across as like saying you guys don’t know anything, but you guys don’t know it. Do you know? And occasionally, I’ll reach out and invite them to join the Academy or just come and get some information. Because the irony is, there are people like me who love sex, who want to be pleased, and who are ready to have sex with men. And then there are men out there who want to have sex with an older woman, but they are not connecting. So, I would say, don’t give up. If you run into a dating site that isn’t satisfactory for you, then go ahead and move on. A lot of them do have payments, and they’ll do them monthly. So, it won’t cost you too much to hop in. But you’ll get a feel right away for whether the women are real or not. And there are a lot of women out there who dress sweaty, and they show a lot. They’re almost like, They’re just an exhibitionist, exhibitionist, and they’re out there. And that would be just right for certain men. So try not to judge. And again, you should be able to tell by asking a few questions of her if she’s somebody that you would be interested in.

Sean 

Yeah, this has been so eye-opening; it has. And I’m so grateful for you sharing all these tips because now I think everyone who listens to this is going to be in that top 1% of guys. If they’re interested in finding someone older than them for just friends with benefits and style stuff, they’re going to be able to avoid all those mistakes that everyone else is making and see success, not waste their money. So thank you so much.

Catherine B. Han

Yours; you’re welcome. And I appreciate it. And I do hope for the Cougars that are out there that they will benefit from this service that you’re providing that, you know, there is a way for good young men, you know, good. They’ve got integrity in place because they’re consenting adults. And as long as one of the things you mentioned very early in this conversation is that you know how to express yourself to what you want, whether you’re interested in just being sexual or in building something relatively long-term, And honestly, from a Cougar’s perspective, from a mature woman’s perspective, Your frankness and ability to be direct about that save a lot of time. And I would never be offended, never to have somebody say, You know, I’m really into sex with strangers. Is that something you do? Like? They say no; I need to know my man. And I need to know that he knows me. There’s nothing wrong with that.

Sean 

Yeah. And you’re going to be writing. I mean, articles for men are proven, so if you guys like Katherine’s stuff, there’s going to be a lot of great articles on milled small details that she’s talked about here. When you can check out men from a.com, men find more of your stuff and more about you, and they can even contact you if they want to work with you.

Catherine B. Han

Absolutely. You can contact me at Katherine, that is, at b breakupcandy.com. ‘ve done a lot of work in the breakup world with both men and women. And I’m finding that these sexual relationships can be quite healing after breakups. Again, that can be a little controversial, and it needs to be handled with kid gloves. But I would be delighted to take any questions that people have to Katherine at breakupcandy.com. And then, if you’re interested, too, and you want to check out the world of my PG-rated erotica and some of the work I have, you can check that out at Angel Says Yes.com.

Sean 

That’s great. Thank you so much, Catherine. It’s been a pleasure. You’re welcome,

Catherine B. Han

Shawn. And hey, if you’re in San Diego, hit me up for coffee.

Sean 

I will. If you guys enjoyed this show, then get ready for an even better podcast in the new year. I love the podcasts that we’ve done so far. And I love the support that all of you have given us on Twitter and through emails. So I’m going to step it up and get the absolute best guests to help you guys become the best men you can be. If you want me to talk about or interview someone, specifically about a specific subject, email me at Shawn at menfroma.com. And let me know what it is. And tell your friends about this podcast. If this is an episode that you think someone would be interested in, send it to them, and you can see me if you want to because I love to see what you guys are up to. And coming in January. I have interviews with Sasha Cobra that are going to help you become the most sexually experienced man that she has ever come across. And this is incredible. It’s going to separate you from so many men, and you’re going to be that guy that women talk about—who’s the sexual God? Then I have interviews with Thomas from the boys’ story. We’re going to talk about how he went from socially anxious to one of the most prolific men alive, living an incredible life, and there’s going to be a lot more, so subscribe on iTunes. And just keep enjoying the show and head to menpermit.com. Get your free starter kit, say what’s up, and never stop improving.